Wanted: Nunuk

[spookmineer]

I bought 3 new games the last 3 years (1 game each year), none of which really stuck.
All were fps games, but how innovative can one still be at that genre? Rockets, rails, are in every (non-realistic) fps game. Prey has a new gimmick that could add something to gameplay but the last couple of years it's just more of the same.

People start to realise (I hope) that it's not the new cool graphics that counts (even if someone says it's more immersive in some keynote), it's Gameplay... And if it's like that, what could a new game really add over an older game?
Wouldn't a relatively simple mod do the trick then?

Shortly after admiring the cool looks, people start to look how to tweak a game because they want a higher framerate. Cool looks are out the window from that moment. They want to play a game smoothly, they have seen the cool graphics and now it's time to play.

And if it boils down to gameplay, one might wonder if the best fps game isn't already around...
Some games (even years old, maybe especially those) have such a rich history, so many cool mods and maps, it's getting harder and harder to imagine how to top that.

Maybe id dug its own grave...?

[obsidian]

Well, you can't blame them for creating some of the best games in the genre... even to perfection we can argue... and then not be able to top them later because they did it all initially.

[spookmineer]

We're on the same wavelenght I guess

[Foo]

I bought 3 new games the last 3 years (1 game each year), none of which really stuck.
All were fps games, but how innovative can one still be at that genre? Rockets, rails, are in every (non-realistic) fps game. Prey has a new gimmick that could add something to gameplay but the last couple of years it's just more of the same.

People start to realise (I hope) that it's not the new cool graphics that counts (even if someone says it's more immersive in some keynote), it's Gameplay... And if it's like that, what could a new game really add over an older game?
Wouldn't a relatively simple mod do the trick then?

Shortly after admiring the cool looks, people start to look how to tweak a game because they want a higher framerate. Cool looks are out the window from that moment. They want to play a game smoothly, they have seen the cool graphics and now it's time to play.

And if it boils down to gameplay, one might wonder if the best fps game isn't already around...
Some games (even years old, maybe especially those) have such a rich history, so many cool mods and maps, it's getting harder and harder to imagine how to top that.

Maybe id dug its own grave...?

Good post. I've similarly bought few games in the past few years, in fact I'm starting to realise I'm not really a gamer in the same sense as most people, I don't want the latest consoles or games, I'd rather potter about to great depth with one game for a period of months or even years.

As for id digging its own grave, I'm not so sure. In terms of the fanboys, I think so... After Q3 which was the biggest hit with the fanboys but not so hot with the mainstream they turned away from that angle almost entirely - and the problem with Q3 is that it's near impossible to supplant with another game unless that other game is as well tweaked as Q3 was - and Q3's balance is pretty much unprecedented.

That's only been made better (or worse?) by mods - RA3, OSP and CPM took Q3's core gameplay and enhanced/evolved it to a state where a lot of players wouldn't want to go backwards - even the thought of playing on vanilla Q3 servers turns a lot of regular players away nowadays, let alone a wholly different game.

However, if id were to publish a polished map pack for a reasonable fee (£10/£17) for Q3 tomorrow, I could see it making reasonable returns. With the rest of the industry turning to episodic content and other non-standard revenue sources/distribution methods, I think if id has problems, they're more the result of being slow to change than having already created the perfect game.

[AEon]

Well what we do might have to do with our age... I used to play many different genres on the Commodore 64 and the Amiga, but on the PC the only game that interested me, and finally motivated me to buy a PC was Doom.

I loved to be able to wander about in a 3D world and discover it. This still holds true today. I never really liked the crappy/stupid violence and especially horror track these games came with. But I tolerated it, especially in Doom 3, because the immersion and the worlds created were interesting to explore.

That is the reason I really liked Uru. Wonderfully detailed world to explore that works without killing. Though the "whacked out" puzzles I often can't solve without cheating tend to annoy. A middle ground would probably - at least for me - be interesting.

I very much enjoyed playing was Knights of the Old Republic (I and II). Those were my first RPGs ever, and it is amazing how much fun it is to solve quests and explore. The battles are usually only on the side. IMO that is the way it should be. Interestingly, I can play 10-15 hours of KotOR straight, and still be relaxed. More than 10 hours of gaming in any shooter makes you almost whack out

If id is going RPG that would be nice. Only such RPGs are usually created by large development teams. No idea how id, a team of about 25, would be able to pull that off. With Doom 3 we saw how painfully long it took them to create the game.

BTW: I wish Q3A had a better LOD system that would let me add vegetation to maps... I like planties, lots of them

[v1l3]

No game tops Q3A. Won't happen. Complete Freeplay, Free Change everything.
Over a 1000 different environments(maps). Tons of player models.

I haven't played Vanilla(Virgin) Q3A in ages. I've been playing it's mods. Q3A changes it's face constantly by alot of people world wide. Made online play known.

Shooters don't get as much attention after Q3A. Perfection of Free-play-code-map-cvars-chat-everything.

Everything is boring after it. Imo

ID will do things right to rebuild Q3 in a different way. I wanna punch Doom and xaero. Make a damn Mortal Kombat arena. weapons...your arms and legs.

Allow people the ability to code new fighting moves, and not tell anybody the moves. Swords...that are restricted to others.

Code that shit => Put the gun down for a bit-back to freeplay.

[uh-lee]

AEon: Have you tried Anachronox?

[Anwulf]

I am probably jaded, but I had the feeling nothing in Q4 or D3 had that mandatory addictiveness - from the very first moment the games were out - compared with Q3A.

I'd have to agree. I eventually got D3 and Q4; played them; let them malinger on my HD for a little while; uninstalled them. I doubt whether I'll ever play them again unless there's some stunningly good reason. I've got more out of finally playing Morrowind.

I'd pretty much agree with spookmineer's post. For one thing, I kind of get the impression that new and next gen fps games are being sold on graphics. I'm thinking of the preview of the next game from Crytek that I saw on gamespot. Much gushing over the graphics, especially the plant life (AEon, you should like that ), but I don't remember thinking the game would be fun to play as much as it would be to go "Ooh!" and "Ah!" at the graphics. And

Crysis is a Sci-Fi FPS game for the PC, where mankind must struggle to survive in the face of an alien invasion.

isn't this Doom, Half-Life etc.?

As for id software, they need to get away from sequels. I didn't know about the RPG for mobile phones.

"The formative computer games of my youth were fantasy games, so I am happy to finally bring one to market,” said John Carmack...

So after Q3, Carmack decided to redo Doom. Now he's going back even further in time. What next? Those old monochrome tennis/ping pong games but with übergraphics, which means they'll only run at 5fps on today's machines?

[axbaby]

well there was talk of bringing back Commander Keen

[hemostick]

... and id has said a few dozen times their new pc game project will be an entirely _new_ IP in the past year or so

[AEon]

uh-lee,
Anachronox... heard the name a few times, but don't actually recall it.

BTW, with my X800 I got Deux Ex - Invisible War... for a "free" RPG that was ok. But it would be a pain having to play that again.

Same is true with Tron 2.0. First time I was really into it, but all the running about and searching would be very annoying the second time round IMO. IOWs never played Deus Ex-IW or Tron 2.0 a second time. Usually I do that.


Anwulf,
about Crysis... actually I did not like the new jungle... I liked the Far Cry jungle just fine, the new one looks too much like boring reality. To me Far Cry was the first game that I could not stop playing, I simply had to explore every map in detail. And... was rewarded by slightly different gameplay and new paths. Something that HL2 totally messed up IMO, that game is a one way street, almost no replay value. Meaning you simply don't find anything new. Compare that to KotOR II... played that 4-5 times and still keep finding new dialogs etc.

Q3A being the best game ever... hmmm... well it is the game I played most, mapped the most for... so in that respect it's probably true. But I really loved Far Cry (SP that is). HL2 was OK, and Doom 3 was so so.

How much Q4 turns out to will depend on if AEtri will actually be played online or not to me. I am not counting on it though. But most of the custom maps out there are simply terrible. Some are quite beautiful but don't play well. Oh well

[Lunaran]

Nunuk probably made the single biggest contribution to quake3 mapping out of anyone, in the form of the geometry-contest style. Subtracting texture to explore value and color on bare form is one of those things quake3 is damn suited for, and it's a look that continues to see heavy use to great effect.

The only mark I really made is that occasionally I'll check out a map and find a circling bird in it. :P

[+JuggerNaut+]

The only mark I really made is that occasionally I'll check out a map and find a circling bird in it. :P

yeah, right. you've made a few of the most classic custom maps out there - Storm, Beer, and Loonies. good times, those

[v1l3]

The only mark I really made

Don't you even start forgettin about cpm23! I was glad when a good mapper was allowed to be a part of the mappacks again. Like the ol' school mappacks...Mr.Clean, Hubster, Q-Fraggel, Wiebo de Wit, Jude, Druzli, etc... lun3dm1..um...ownz!

[uh-lee]

Anachronox... heard the name a few times, but don't actually recall it.

Well, I just thought of it after your previous post. It's one of my favourite games, and your description seems to match it quite well. Since apparently (and unbelievably!) few people know it, I just wanted to mention it. :-)