I'm just going to leave this here...

[LawL]

It can be inside the house after he found them, if you can argue enough time had passed and he acted with the intent to kill after he had time to access and act upon a situation.

The gun jamming should have given him plenty of breathing room to consider his actions, let alone dragging her down to the basement and finishing her off ?

An argument can always be made, sure. It's never black and white, that's why I use such extreme examples. From what little information we have from this article though it does seem like second degree to me.

[MKJ]

You know a lot about these things, LawL. Have you considered getting a law degree?

[LawL]

Nah.

[losCHUNK]

Well aye, I meant if you kill someone through actions when you wasn't expecting the outcome, like a 3rd party in a shoot out, with accidental and manslaughter having a closer resemblance to eachother like 1st to 2nd degree ?

I'm not entirely sure what you're asking. But where manslaughter is concerned it depends whether a "reasonable person" should have had the foresight to realise what they were doing could cause someone's death. If you lived alone on a 10000 acre farm and decided to go shooting wabbits and from a mile away accidentally shot and killed some vagrant who, unknown to you, was trespassing on your land then it would be very difficult to prove manslaughter. If you lived in a block of units and decided to use your bedroom wall for target practice and a bullet went through the wall and killed your neighbour while they were watching TV then it would be quite easy to prove manslaughter.

Aye I think were on the same page, your right it's not to do with wanting to inflict harm it's more to do with the persons intentions in the 1st place. I'm just a retard.

It can be inside the house after he found them, if you can argue enough time had passed and he acted with the intent to kill after he had time to access and act upon a situation.

The gun jamming should have given him plenty of breathing room to consider his actions, let alone dragging her down to the basement and finishing her off ?

An argument can always be made, sure. It's never black and white, that's why I use such extreme examples. From what little information we have from this article though it does seem like second degree to me.

And spose, Just thought the gun jamming and dragging them off for a finisher would be more than enough and was usually the charge for those situations, it's why i did'nt include the 1st murder in the quote because I thought that had the possibility of being 2nd degree

[LawL]

It's all speculation at this point. The prosecution could certainly push for a charge of first degree if they felt it was warranted once more details come out.

[losCHUNK]

I was wondering how the media acquired direct quotes from an on going investigation ?

Shits not usually public knowledge in our country and for good reason.

[scared?]

if they broke in his house...they got what they deserved...

[Κracus]

I don't agree that they deserved that, but I also feel that they took the risk doing something they knew was illegal and dangerous.

[shaft]

I'm going to read between the lines and assume he knew they were going to break in. Which is why he wasn't with his family for Thanksgiving and at his second property hiding in his basement waiting with a gun. First degree. BAM.

Also, I didn't read anything Chunk said, but by Lawl's responses I hope Chunk is just trolling and didn't need to have all that shit explained to him.

[Nightshade]

I'll wait for sys0p and Nightshade to come down into this thread and argue how this is a completely sane course of action to take if someone enters your house.

Yeah, this sort of statement just proves that you're extremely hard of thinking. The guy in this case is not only stupid, but quite crazy. If you shoot someone and they drop, they're no longer a threat and that's the point at which you watch them closely while you call the cops.

That's guy's nuts are you're a retard that doesn't actually pay attention to anything I've posted.

[MKJ]

That.

[GONNAFISTYA]

I'm going to read between the lines and assume he knew they were going to break in. Which is why he wasn't with his family for Thanksgiving and at his second property hiding in his basement waiting with a gun. First degree. BAM.

I was wondering the exact same thing.

[GONNAFISTYA]

The guy in this case is not only stupid, but quite crazy.

That describes anyone who’d want to use a gun for home defense: stupid and crazy.

If you shoot someone and they drop, they're no longer a threat and that's the point at which you watch them closely while you call the cops.

If you shoot someone you’re probably a crazy person.

[scared?]

Lol no...

[bitWISE]

I'm going to read between the lines and assume he knew they were going to break in. Which is why he wasn't with his family for Thanksgiving and at his second property hiding in his basement waiting with a gun. First degree. BAM.

Aye

[Eraser]

I'll wait for sys0p and Nightshade to come down into this thread and argue how this is a completely sane course of action to take if someone enters your house.

Yeah, this sort of statement just proves that you're extremely hard of thinking. The guy in this case is not only stupid, but quite crazy. If you shoot someone and they drop, they're no longer a threat and that's the point at which you watch them closely while you call the cops.

That's guy's nuts are you're a retard that doesn't actually pay attention to anything I've posted.

You were easy

[xer0s]

That's guy's nuts are you're a retard that doesn't actually pay attention to anything I've posted.

What is going on with this sentence?

[MKJ]

if you gon run than stay away, iceman
jus sayin

[xer0s]

...anyone who’d want to use a gun for home defense: stupid and crazy.

I disagree.

But this topic has been beat to death, and it's just easier to agree to disagree...

[Nightshade]

You were easy

Taking a post you make seriously when it falls directly in line with most of your other posts doesn't justify an "END OF TEST" moment on your part.

Shitty troll is shitty.

[Nightshade]

That's guy's nuts are you're a retard that doesn't actually pay attention to anything I've posted.

What is going on with this sentence?

Oh dear god, an extraneous apostrophe and a superfluous 'S'. The heavens may fall...

[losCHUNK]

Also, I didn't read anything Chunk said, but by Lawl's responses I hope Chunk is just trolling and didn't need to have all that shit explained to him.

lol, If you read what I said, it was clearing up confusion and I still believe it to be 1st degree murrdurr if the article is correct and if only for the gun jamming, which is what I originally said. Lawl thinks otherwise but it's a grey area imo and it's obvious he knows more about it than I do.

The only thing I was unsure of was that pre-meditated was required for 1st degree basing it on different cases, but that was cleared up because pre-meditated doesn't necessarily mean having a plan 2 weeks in advance, which is what Lawl was saying in his extreme cases.

nice troll.

[GONNAFISTYA]

...anyone who’d want to use a gun for home defense: stupid and crazy.

I disagree.

Sure...go ahead and disagree. But the only people who disagree with my statement are the stupid and crazy people. And before anyone claims I’m being outright dismissive, I’ll admit as much....just like I’d admit that I’d be just as dismissive of someone arguing that gravity makes things fall up instead of down. Stupid and crazy is stupid and crazy and I no longer care if I’m not being "open minded" enough. If you want to argue "perspective" I’ll go that route too...and say you have a stupid and crazy perspective on things.

That’s why this topic never gets anywhere...because the stupid and crazy people won’t admit that their ideology and their feelings towards other people is indeed stupid and crazy. Just like a psychotic will never admit that the voices in his head aren’t real. You might as well try to stop gravity from working.

Those who shoot others to settle anything aren’t rational people, no matter how many times they, their crazy friends and the voices inside their heads say they are.

[xer0s]

If a guy comes into your house with a knife or gun and plans on killing you and raping your wife, it's not a smart move to have a gun to defend yourself and your family? WTF?

Damnit, I didn't want to get into this...

[Κracus]

Also if you create a gravitational force above you, you will fall up.