At least the Democrats have stopped him being unconsitutional
I'm not going to bother calling Bush an idiot, but I'm pretty sure that he has no formal medical or legal training whatsoever. In fact I don't even give a shit about that, either; but I'm certain that he's never had to make a single one-on-one, personal decision to let someone live or die; and he's never had to develop the skills needed to make, explain or justify that decision. Cunt.
Bush is now in charge of life and death. Fucking great.
What the fuck is wrong with people? Why does her family want her to stay alive? What's the point of living like that? I mean, sorry, but we're all going to die sooner or later... if I ever end up like that, I'd rather die right then, not 20 years later. I can't imagine anyone thinking otherwise. Fucking hell.
Except all the decisions he made as governor of Texas, when he did the exact opposite and made the final decision to execute retards. GG Georgie boy! :icon14:Geebs wrote:At least the Democrats have stopped him being unconsitutional
I'm not going to bother calling Bush an idiot, but I'm pretty sure that he has no formal medical or legal training whatsoever. In fact I don't even give a shit about that, either; but I'm certain that he's never had to make a single one-on-one, personal decision to let someone live or die; and he's never had to develop the skills needed to make, explain or justify that decision. Cunt.
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GONNAFISTYA
- Posts: 13369
- Joined: Sun Jan 23, 2005 8:20 pm
I piss my pants laughing all the time at the conservative right.
They talk about the "sanctity of life" and all that shit when it comes to cripples, retards, euthanasia and the unborn. Yet they're the first to want the death penalty, the first to want to go to war and the first to damn anyone "to hail!" who disagrees with them.
Bush probably said "Praise God!" whenever he signed another death row inmate's execution paper. Most people already know he set the record for executions and made fun of death row inmates. I'm sure he thought he was "cleansing" God's green Earth of evil or some damned thing.
It truely is hilarious and sad at the same time that half a country actually thinks the way he does.
They talk about the "sanctity of life" and all that shit when it comes to cripples, retards, euthanasia and the unborn. Yet they're the first to want the death penalty, the first to want to go to war and the first to damn anyone "to hail!" who disagrees with them.
Bush probably said "Praise God!" whenever he signed another death row inmate's execution paper. Most people already know he set the record for executions and made fun of death row inmates. I'm sure he thought he was "cleansing" God's green Earth of evil or some damned thing.
It truely is hilarious and sad at the same time that half a country actually thinks the way he does.
I've done a bit of time in oncology/palliative medicine, and the whole "prolong life at all costs" thing ends up completely fucking your brain unless you just do what the patient wants. If you feel like banging your head against a wall you can try to inform them first, but it rarely makes much difference. But hell, this woman hasn't cost the taxpayer much in terms of smart bombs. If it was her stated opinion that she wanted to live as long as possible, even in a vegetative state, then that's her right. I think part of the problem is that her stated opinion's a bit muddy.bitWISE wrote:I think its stupid to try to save people who have little to no chance of surviving.
GWB is still a cunt.
Yea, hardcore bible-thumpers are doing their damndest to legislate their views on everything from medicine to science education. We are STILL having debates in this country about evolution vs. Intelligent Design (a laughably pathetic pseudo-intellectual Trojan Horse that is really nothing more than creationism is a cheap suit), and there are even scientific creationists trying to get a voice in the debates...and the sad thing is, they are gaining momentum again.
It is unbelievable how so many people in this country are willing to ignore everything that the experts in a given area say in favor of the views presented by uneducated (relative to the particular subject) suit wearing businessmen who are playing the masses like a fucking fiddle by pandering to their religious views.
You know, people will go see an doctor when they feel like shit, and, more often than not, they will believe the doctor when he tells them what he thinks is wrong with them. They believe him because he has training in medicine, has seen countless patients, has is therefore able to develop a more educated (and thus more reasonable) diagnosis and treatment for the ailment. How many people walk out of the doctors and say "I don't believe a fucking word he said" after getting their diagnosis and treatment? Not many (although there are definitely some...and in some cases they are right.) But, by and large, the people accept the doc's opinions regarding medical issues. Most would not feel qualified to tell the doc he doesn't know what the hell he is talking about (notice I said 'most'). Now, take these same people, and make the issue evolution, or even the case going on right now with the woman on life support. How many of them accept the scientist's theories and explanations regarding evolution? For some reason, because they have a little black book that apparently gives them all the answers, they suddenly feel entitled to discount the entire theory, and everything that it entails, because it doesn't fit into their narrow interpretation of a book. They wouldn't feel comfortable debating the efficacy of a given cancer therapy with an oncologist, yet they are more than comfortable telling a molecular evolutionist that he is dead ass wrong...
I'll wrap up these ramblings with a simple message - the stranglehold that religion can take over a person's ability to apply logic and reason to a situation is frightening. The current administration is playing that fact very much to their advantage, and we are going to see progress in many fields (i.e. embryonic stem cell research) stifled for it.
Dark ages, here we come.
It is unbelievable how so many people in this country are willing to ignore everything that the experts in a given area say in favor of the views presented by uneducated (relative to the particular subject) suit wearing businessmen who are playing the masses like a fucking fiddle by pandering to their religious views.
You know, people will go see an doctor when they feel like shit, and, more often than not, they will believe the doctor when he tells them what he thinks is wrong with them. They believe him because he has training in medicine, has seen countless patients, has is therefore able to develop a more educated (and thus more reasonable) diagnosis and treatment for the ailment. How many people walk out of the doctors and say "I don't believe a fucking word he said" after getting their diagnosis and treatment? Not many (although there are definitely some...and in some cases they are right.) But, by and large, the people accept the doc's opinions regarding medical issues. Most would not feel qualified to tell the doc he doesn't know what the hell he is talking about (notice I said 'most'). Now, take these same people, and make the issue evolution, or even the case going on right now with the woman on life support. How many of them accept the scientist's theories and explanations regarding evolution? For some reason, because they have a little black book that apparently gives them all the answers, they suddenly feel entitled to discount the entire theory, and everything that it entails, because it doesn't fit into their narrow interpretation of a book. They wouldn't feel comfortable debating the efficacy of a given cancer therapy with an oncologist, yet they are more than comfortable telling a molecular evolutionist that he is dead ass wrong...
I'll wrap up these ramblings with a simple message - the stranglehold that religion can take over a person's ability to apply logic and reason to a situation is frightening. The current administration is playing that fact very much to their advantage, and we are going to see progress in many fields (i.e. embryonic stem cell research) stifled for it.
Dark ages, here we come.
Actually, he was personally responsible; it's almost the same situation. For every inmate on death row, he had to review every case and decide whether they deserved to live or die. Alberto Gonzales was his legal advisor on these. Gonzales would look at the cases and give Bush the relevant information for the case, and Bush would decide whether they lived or died, on a case-by-case basis. In one pretty famous case, he sent a mentally-retarded woman to die, and later even mocked her pleas for life on national television.Geebs wrote:Yeah, but he didn't have to be personally and directly responsible for their deaths.
Come to think of it, it might be a better idea not to let the doctors make these kinds of decisions. I'm tortured by a constant desire to leave people outside the igloo.
If she never wanted to be in this state, and it's her life we're talking about, and there's no way to get her out of this miserable state of existence, then I say by all means let her go and end the crap that her life has become. The only time I dont condone suicide is when there's the possibility that someone could be reaching out for help. She's not reaching out for help, but rather is in a helpless state of misery. Her body is alive, but that's about it. I'd personally never want to be in her position, and empathetically hope her death comes sooner rather than later.
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Guest
I believe her parents are saying that she is still able to respond (in a very limited manner) to the presence of people she knows...her face 'lights up' when they talk with her...Kracus wrote:It's all about money anyway. Who the fuck cares whether she's alive or dead? Technicly she's braindead. She's NOT suffering, she's NOT in pain, she doesn't give a shit what's going on, or whether she's dead or alive.
Yeah, but you can argue he's not really responsible because he has insufficient understanding to actually be making this sort of decision. This is why it's useful to make sure all of your leaders are either morons or psychos.R00k wrote: In one pretty famous case, he sent a mentally-retarded woman to die, and later even mocked her pleas for life on national television.
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Guest
Yeah it takes money to keep her alive, obviously a person can't afford to keep someone alive in a hospital for that long without medical insurance of sometype.tnf wrote:I'd guess he thinks its about money because it is expensive to keep her alive. Or that the hospital makes money for her being alive.
My point however was that if she's a vegtable, what's the big fuss over whether she's dead or alive. She's a vegetable. Who the fuck cares? If the people that want her to be kept alive REALLY want her alive then they should pay for it, it's that simple imho.
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Guest
Yeah bullshit, This isn't Canada we're talking about. Any type of medicare in the US is EXPENSIVE. Check the costs of staying 2 day's in a hospital in the US for a couple major hospitals.Geebs wrote:PEG feeding's pretty cheap. She's only expensive in terms of 24 hour care; and if the relatives are doing that, it's pretty cheap too.
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Guest
No she's not home, she was in a Hospice and was recently moved to a hospital after her IV was restored according to a news article I just read.Geebs wrote:At home, like she has been for the last 15 years.
http://www.psychlaws.org/GeneralResources/article27.htm
Has a little info on medical costs in Florida where I beleive she's at right now.
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SplishSplash
- Posts: 4467
- Joined: Sun Dec 03, 2000 8:00 am
Explainer: Who's paying for her care
I say let her die gracefully. But don't starve her to death. No matter whether she feels it or not, it's going to freak people out (me included).
I say let her die gracefully. But don't starve her to death. No matter whether she feels it or not, it's going to freak people out (me included).