OK, so a new track i'm working on...

[plained]

specially with those lame ass beats and beat tones :lol:

[DRuM]

hey Brisk, i love alot of hardware generated music too, but for you to say to Drum that he'd get a "lesson in percussion" from electronic beats is, well, kinda funny.

That's the irony of it. We've come full circle and the desktop programmers start to tell the musicians where to get lessons, heh .

[brisk]

that's what i was afraid of - that it wasn't a kit.

I give in.

Lol I'm sorry brisk. You do seem overly impressed with music that is programmed. Did you think the drums on that 54 Cymru Beats were real? Or you don't care about real instruments? There are casio keyboards in schools I teach in. Hold down one key, instant drum 'n bass groove! Wow.

lol

I honestly don't know what to say. I used to have a casio keyboard, and despite my best efforts, I couldn't get it to produce beats like that (mainly because it could only play a few piano-type instruments, and didn't actually have a sequencer or indeed percussive sounds to actuallt make a "drum n bass groove").

If making percussive rhythms like those on Drukqs was easy (and i'm sorry to keep going on about that album, since its not even one of the better Aphex works), everyone would be doing it. And I assure you, very few can.

[DRuM]

I'm sorry brisk for being such a cunt. I just can't help myself when it comes to some music, right or wrong. :icon28:

[Keep It Real]

you guys are fucking dorks

[diego]

That's the irony of it. We've come full circle and the desktop programmers start to tell the musicians where to get lessons, heh .

Dont flame teh programmerz

[brisk]

hey Brisk, i love alot of hardware generated music too, but for you to say to Drum that he'd get a "lesson in percussion" from electronic beats is, well, kinda funny.

From a traditional perspective, yes you're right.

All i'm saying is that you simply cannot make these kind of sounds with just a drum kit alone. Maybe you guys are of the school of thought that synthesisers and drum machines are their just to mimic the sound of their real life brother... and maybe they do to a degree, but the really creative and forward thinking people knew that you could use these devices as a tool to create NEW sounds, and different patterns of expression.

I still find it incredibly confusing how people seem to distinct electronic music as "fake" or "easy", when in more cases than not, it is the exact opposite.

[brisk]

specially with those lame ass beats and beat tones :lol:

Oh i'm sorry, I thought you were describing the sound your average sentence makes when I try to read it in this forum :lol:

[DRuM]

lol

I honestly don't know what to say. I used to have a casio keyboard, and despite my best efforts, I couldn't get it to produce beats like that (mainly because it could only play a few piano-type instruments, and didn't actually have a sequencer or indeed percussive sounds to actuallt make a "drum n bass groove").

If making percussive rhythms like those on Drukqs was easy (and i'm sorry to keep going on about that album, since its not even one of the better Aphex works), everyone would be doing it. And I assure you, very few can.

Man, it's easy to make those rhythms if you have a percussive mind.
All you have to do is know your software and take time programming the beats in. Not to mention there's loads of those drum samples that can be downloaded and used aren't there?
I've also heard lots of CD's with those type of beats, he ain't breaking any new ground.

[DRuM]

I still find it incredibly confusing how people seem to distinct electronic music as "fake" or "easy", when in more cases than not, it is the exact opposite.

I think we had a discussion similar to this in a dmmh thread a little while back.

[werldhed]

hey Brisk, i love alot of hardware generated music too, but for you to say to Drum that he'd get a "lesson in percussion" from electronic beats is, well, kinda funny.

From a traditional perspective, yes you're right.

All i'm saying is that you simply cannot make these kind of sounds with just a drum kit alone. Maybe you guys are of the school of thought that synthesisers and drum machines are their just to mimic the sound of their real life brother... and maybe they do to a degree, but the really creative and forward thinking people knew that you could use these devices as a tool to create NEW sounds, and different patterns of expression.

I still find it incredibly confusing how people seem to distinct electronic music as "fake" or "easy", when in more cases than not, it is the exact opposite.

I'm going to respectfully disagree with you here. I have no problem with electronic music; I like a good amount of it. As a former drummer, though, it's difficult not to notice the lack of sound quality from drum machines. As for it being easy, I used a music synth program in high school years ago and found producing such rhythms not difficult in the least. Does it take talent and know-how? Sure. Is it as difficult as producing music from instruments? Not remotely.

[DRuM]

That's the irony of it. We've come full circle and the desktop programmers start to tell the musicians where to get lessons, heh .

Dont flame teh programmerz

:lub:

[brisk]

I've also heard lots of CD's with those type of beats, he ain't breaking any new ground.

Name them.

[DRuM]

I've also heard lots of CD's with those type of beats, he ain't breaking any new ground.

Name them.

No idea, they were all totally unmemorable.

brisk, check this.

http://www.jojomayer.com/html/high.html

[brisk]

hey Brisk, i love alot of hardware generated music too, but for you to say to Drum that he'd get a "lesson in percussion" from electronic beats is, well, kinda funny.

From a traditional perspective, yes you're right.

All i'm saying is that you simply cannot make these kind of sounds with just a drum kit alone. Maybe you guys are of the school of thought that synthesisers and drum machines are their just to mimic the sound of their real life brother... and maybe they do to a degree, but the really creative and forward thinking people knew that you could use these devices as a tool to create NEW sounds, and different patterns of expression.

I still find it incredibly confusing how people seem to distinct electronic music as "fake" or "easy", when in more cases than not, it is the exact opposite.

I'm going to respectfully disagree with you here. I have no problem with electronic music; I like a good amount of it. As a former drummer, though, it's difficult not to notice the lack of sound quality from drum machines. As for it being easy, I used a music synth program in high school years ago and found producing such rhythms not difficult in the least. Does it take talent and know-how? Sure. Is it as difficult as producing music from instruments? Not remotely.

It depends what kinda music you've been listening to. Standard 4/4 stuff, or even basic hip-hop, and broken beat stuff can be done on a drum kit or a drum machine. But stuff like Squarepusher or Venetian Snares? Less so

With regards to sound quality, it depends. If they're using some old 808 drum machine, then obviously its gonna sound inferior (but that is half of the charm if you ask me ).

Many electronic artists use breakbeats or drum loop samples from real percussionists anyway, and then cut them up and rearrange them. So any difference in sound quality is only due to recording conditions, or any additional effects the artist may put on them. The amen break is a good example - its been used in pretty much every jungle track out there, but put it in the hands of someone like squarepusher, and it can sound radically different.

[DRuM]

I usually find that most things programmed that can't actually be played by a real musician generally doesn't feel very good anyway. Pushing technical boundaries by programming music in obscure ways doesn't necessarily mean great music.

[brisk]

Name them.

No idea, they were all totally unmemorable.

brisk, check this.

http://www.jojomayer.com/html/high.html

I appreciate the skill of the drummer and find that taking influence from programmed beats and bringing it into a live situation is interesting, but the music was generally horrible. White boy MC telling us to "make some noise" ? Yes, indeed.

And its exactly my point. If he can produce these sounds instrumentally and take direct influence from the programmed equivilent, then how is one any better than the other? Its all just a means to an end anyway.

The only thing I said was that programmed beats allow the artist to produce sounds and rhythms which would otherwise be impossible. Thats all

[DRuM]

I appreciate the skill of the drummer and find that taking influence from programmed beats and bringing it into a live situation is interesting, but the music was generally horrible. White boy MC telling us to "make some noise" ? Yes, indeed.

And its exactly my point. If he can produce these sounds instrumentally and take direct influence from the programmed equivilent, then how is one any better than the other? Its all just a means to an end anyway.

Erm, you seem to forget that if it wasn't for real drummers developing the drumset and grooves in the first place, there would be no programmed beats anyway. Those beats he's playing aren't that removed from classic funk and fusion grooves. They're just sped up. It's not my favourite music either, but it sure beats the hell out of a lot of programmed stuff because it's human and has real feel to it.

[Dave]

I'm with brisk.. drum, booger, old

[plained]

specially with those lame ass beats and beat tones :lol:

Oh i'm sorry, I thought you were describing the sound your average sentence makes when I try to read it in this forum :lol:

brisk why isit you only respond when i suedo flaem you?

i tested this out over 5 times and you ignore my usefull comments but insult me straight away after a neg remark.

so yea why man?

[brisk]

Cos i'm a real bastard.

[Don Carlos]

Cos i'm a real bastard.

w3rd

[+JuggerNaut+]

I'm with brisk.. drum, booger, old

[Dave]

I'm with brisk.. drum, booger, old

You still type on a typewriter don't you?

[Keep It Real]

http://www.thepuzl.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/samples/pawp.mp3 (about 5mb)

Its a happy, bright, sad, gay, hetero, retro, trancey, techno, melodic, rhythmic, pop song and i've got about half of it done so far. I'm building up towards a nice ambient-type breakdown, and then i'm gonna reintroduce the percussion and bring on a full string assault.

Its very different to what i'd normally produce, but I can never listen to any particular style of music for longer than an hour anyway.

Anyway, i'd be happy if you could tell me what you think of it so far, and if the response is good, I will actually try and finish it.

Points to note:

I realise the introduction of the strings is slightly off at the momment, though that will be easy to fix.

Its a tad samey before the main synth melody is introduced, thought I plan to fill that up with numerous effects and sweeps as required.

It ends quite abruptly. Thats just cos I haven't done anything past that bit yet.

The bassline is perhaps a tad strong. I'll probably lower the low freq EQ when I finish it/master it properly.

Thats all for now. Enjoy (or not)

wack