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What gaming really needs....
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 10:50 am
by Geebs
is an FPS without any shooting. Think about it for a second: if all you're doing to interact with the game is point and click, developers can get away with mindless AI, no interaction with the environment, no plot even. Plus who here isn't sick to death of having to wade through wave after wave of generic baby-meets-lawnmower enemies just to get to the next plot development?
Imagine if Doom3 hadn't had any shooting. I had a quick blast through Doom2 the other day and it completely owned, because it was ridiculously fast and involved wiping out tons of bad guys coming from all directions. Then I went back to Doom3, and had fun plugging a series of aliens in the head as they appeared from the same shaft one by one. With fewer bad guys, they could have fleshed out the plot, thrown in some puzzles that weren't completely mindless, added a few more bits and bobs to look at with the searchlight, and had a better beginning section so you actually gave a fuck about this Sarge guy who basically just comes across as a bit of a dick. They could have also added some AI which actually hunted you as opposed to hiding in a cupboard. They could also have made some more interesting level geometry (part of the reason the AI in Halo comes across as so smart is because it doesn't have much environment to negotiate; as opposed to getting stuck while walking downstairs in a rather non-demonic sort of way), rather than the cube-with-a-machine-and-some-pipes aesthetic.
Ho hum.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 10:56 am
by DiscoDave
An FPS without any shooting wouldn't be a FPS
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 10:56 am
by U4EA
Donnie Brasco is a great movie. Fuggedaboutit!
Re: What gaming really needs....
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:03 am
by [xeno]Julios
Geebs wrote:
Ho hum.
u ever play system shock 2, deus ex, or mdk2?
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 11:06 am
by Geebs
Both of the first 2. System Shock 2 went about the no shooting idea the wrong way - "no shooting because my gun just fucking broke AGAIN and despite my 6 years marine training I can't fix it.". But yeah, Deus Ex is an example of a shooter where the whole game's so damn good, you don't even need to shoot anyone to enjoy it
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:09 pm
by Grudge
We need more adventure games. Fucking RPGs killed that genre.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:17 pm
by U4EA
Yea, it was too bad when first the Full Throttle and then the Sam and Max sequels got canned.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:42 pm
by phantasmagoria
Grudge wrote:We need more adventure games. Fucking RPGs killed that genre.
Hell yeah, imagine Day of the Tentacle with todays graphics
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:06 pm
by 4days
does anyone here like traditional puzzles in their fps games? - like in ss2 where you have to hack your way through doors by finding 3 blocks in a line, that sort of thing.
always been happy enough to just shoot stuff myself, but know a few people that have said they'd like to see more involved tasks in games - e.g. in team-based mp games, having to do some sort of puzzle to disarm a bomb rather than just hold down a 'use' key - or the lock-picking in thief.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:41 pm
by booker
what your talking about is a first person tomb raider then?
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:44 pm
by phantasmagoria
booker wrote:what your talking about is a first person tomb raider then?
no, tomb raider didn't really test (at least 1, 2 and 3 didnt) your brainpower, they just tested your eyesight and how well you could jump from one block to another. It wasn't really puzzle solving.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 1:56 pm
by eepberries
If I wanted to do puzzles, I'd get a fucking puzzle book. If I wanted to shoot stuff, I'd load up doom 3.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 4:56 pm
by Mat Linnett
Off-topic, but you really need to get yerself a Cube and a copy of Resident Evil 4 Geebs.
I'm sure it's the sort of game you'd appreciate.
Back on-topic, I agree, we need more FPS games forcing the player to think rather than shoot.
's why I like the Thief series so much.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 4:59 pm
by CrinklyArse
eepberries wrote:If I wanted to do puzzles, I'd get a fucking puzzle book. If I wanted to shoot stuff, I'd load up doom 3.
:icon14:
though i agree that some games do need to be a little more challenging. Personnally it Depends on my mood. If i wanna shoot the hell outa somethin crazily i'll load up somethin like doom 3 or if i wanna think about it then somethin else that requires more thought (cant think of an example but you get the point)
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:00 pm
by Pext
hellgate: london by flagship possibly; ...
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:03 pm
by bitWISE
Wait till you see the game I'm going to create eventually. There has never been anything like it because this game is targetted specifically at the most hardcore gamers. I can't really describe it without giving away what is unique about the conecpt. And I dont have the time or the skills to do it yet
.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:05 pm
by Bdw3
Myst series....?
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:07 pm
by eepberries
I do think it would be cool though to have a FPS that was more based on strategy while at the same wasn't "real guns - sneak around like an asshat - die in one shot"
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:12 pm
by Canis
Bdw3 wrote:Myst series....?
Was just thinking that as I scrolled down, but I think he wants more action as well. A Doom/Myst mix would be cool, where you have to infiltrate, solve puzzles, and get around without being noticed or caught, etc. "Thief" was cool in this respect, but I never got into that game.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:14 pm
by reefsurfer
DiscoDave wrote:An FPS without any shooting wouldn't be a FPS
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:15 pm
by o'dium
exactly, it would be a FP...
BTW, you should try Riddick. One of the best first person games to come out for a long time, and you dont have ot fire a gun at all if you dont want to.
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:17 pm
by Canis
reefsurfer wrote:DiscoDave wrote:An FPS without any shooting wouldn't be a FPS
Clearly he means a "First-Person" perspective game (rendered like popular FPS games) that involves puzzle solving and more brain power than blasting shit until nothing moves... :icon22:
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:18 pm
by SplishSplash
Maybe Dr. Geebs should try out "Vampire: Bloodlines".
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 5:24 pm
by Guest
Wait wait... I think maybe, just MAYBE the reason they don't have games like that is because it'd be pointless and annoying. Cause I mean really what are you doing? You're running around looking for puzzles.
Well do I have news for you! Those games already exist they're called puzzle games! Imagine that!? Yeah they're really neat cause you have these puzzles to solve and when you solve them you move on to different kinds of puzzles. Simple really cause it kinda eliminates the need for running around and shit to find the puzzles which is basicly pointless and irritating and can be done via CG or any kind of storyline type of enviroment without actualy NEEDING to walk around.
Cause every other type of puzzle game involving FPS modes are games like Tomb Raider and maybe Splinter Cell and Resident Evil and every other game that has them involves the FPS into the game which invariably involves interaction with other creatures that you need to fight. Metroid Prime is a good example as is Echoes.
My point is you're a retard.
Re: What gaming really needs....
Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 6:30 pm
by feedback
Geebs wrote:is an FPS without any shooting. Think about it for a second: if all you're doing to interact with the game is point and click, developers can get away with mindless AI, no interaction with the environment, no plot even. Plus who here isn't sick to death of having to wade through wave after wave of generic baby-meets-lawnmower enemies just to get to the next plot development?
Imagine if Doom3 hadn't had any shooting. I had a quick blast through Doom2 the other day and it completely owned, because it was ridiculously fast and involved wiping out tons of bad guys coming from all directions. Then I went back to Doom3, and had fun plugging a series of aliens in the head as they appeared from the same shaft one by one. With fewer bad guys, they could have fleshed out the plot, thrown in some puzzles that weren't completely mindless, added a few more bits and bobs to look at with the searchlight, and had a better beginning section so you actually gave a fuck about this Sarge guy who basically just comes across as a bit of a dick. They could have also added some AI which actually hunted you as opposed to hiding in a cupboard. They could also have made some more interesting level geometry (part of the reason the AI in Halo comes across as so smart is because it doesn't have much environment to negotiate; as opposed to getting stuck while walking downstairs in a rather non-demonic sort of way), rather than the cube-with-a-machine-and-some-pipes aesthetic.
Ho hum.
The best FPS games are already the ones where you can do many things to negate shooting, and interact in other ways. Deus Ex and System Shock 2 are still fucking brilliant.