Quake3World

busetibi wrote:

losCHUNK wrote:


but you cant say as a whole player for player... Ni are better



Nireland played very well, congrats on the win but england arent at the best of there game atm and ireland was :]

i cant say shit mainly cause i didnt see the match, nor do i want to see it,
the better team won
simple really.
toe rag seremtan can make all the excuses under the sun, fact is according to him, england had the best/strongest side they could field, and yet they still got done by a bunch of bomb throwing provos

lol, and you didn't even see the match. NI's tactic from the word go was to stop england from playing their game (something obvious to anyone who DID see the match). notice how no one talks about england trying to stop NI from playing *their* game. if you understand anything about football - which you clearly don't - you know that's a tacit acknowledgement that england are the superior side, and that the only way NI could get a result is to stifle england's play. you may remember (or not) that this tactic gave greece (GREECE FFS) a euro2004 trophy.

christ mate get a clue before you sound off

Wrap it up any way you want seremtan, England lost to a billion times shitter team. And England were trying to win too, which makes it worse.

You know what the NI fans were singing in the stands last night?
"Are you Scotland in disguise?"


England are shite™

i'm not saying they didn't play like utter donkeys because that was obvious.

And England were trying to win too, which makes it worse.

lol, what? as opposed to trying to not win?

anyway, think back to the last world cup final: brazil (only just qualified by the skin of their teeth) vs germany (worst german team in decades, crushed 5-1 by us only the year earlier).

learn the difference between class and form. NI never stood a chance of being germany next summer. we still do. go figure

england were trying to win, there is a diff, between a half assed effort and an effort and england were putting in an effort.... they want to finish the group top dogs and the way poland is going... :]

and this is why i dont support england, when they loose its always someone elses fault

like when wales won the granslam, its because wilko didnt play, well heres some news, we can do it without a johnny

edit: and it not a hate against england, i feel the same way against italy and germany.... i cheer for the underdog if wales isnt in it... in the euro i was rooting for portugal, in world cup i was rooting holland and so on

losCHUNK wrote:england were trying to win

seremtan wrote:lol, what? as opposed to trying to not win?

i don't get this "trying to win" business, as though any team would be trying to do something else other than win.

there is a diff, between a half assed effort and an effort and england were putting in an effort....

aight ?

hm, except what i saw (and what all the commentary i've read confirms) was england putting in a dismal pisspoor effort made even worse by bad tactics. there's a difference between trying to win and putting in an effort. NI put in an effort too, but they blatantly weren't trying to win (sanchez's negative closing-down tactics speak for themselves)

sorry mate, but i've seen england "putting in an effort" and the results were beatings for germany, argentina etc. they just had a shit night and played like dogs that's all.

listen, every dog has its day and thats all that happened, yes england were shit but poor old sven was trying to get a win and lost

yes, he was trying because he was trying to get mr golden boots to score a goal whilst at the same time fucking everyone else up in the process...i wont call e ngland shit, because i know they aint, but england were looking for a win and ireland ruined that....

IF england fluffs the next 2 games, then you know its curtains

They were trying but the tactics weren't there. They've been heading for a shock defeat for a long time and said that about 10 minutes before NI scored last night.

They're not going to win every time they put in an effort, they tried but they played poorly. I'm not for a second saying they're a bad side, if they had the tactics right then that effort they were putting in would have been enough to take NI and Wales to pieces. They looked like they weren't trying because there wasn't any invention, you can't take shot after shot without being in position.

they just had a shit night and played like dogs that's all.

That bit I agree with along with the negative tactics. It was down to playing badly, not lack of effort.

when i checked the scores out, i couldnt help but rofl at seeing england lose this. then i went to :'( to see ireland lost to france

lol - look it seems fairly simple to me - sven has no ideas - the same was said in the last world cup finals - when push comes to shove he never has any answers - when his initial system starts to fail he NEVER has an answer - thats the managers job -

NI did a great job initially of crowding england out - BUT the fact that pretty much every forward player (Gerrard, Lampard, Rooney etc) were forced into unnatural roles to support the the use of beckham in a holding / distribution role and single striker of owen made the system inneffective - he should have acted early - gone 4 4 2 - put rooney in the slot under owen - and job done - its fucking simple - yet he persisted trying to keep the 4 5 1 and for the last 40 minutes (after the shuffle of players) - no one new where they were needed - ffs the last half there was no left wing other than cole (who needs to play wing back with the protection of a left to drop in and cover) ..
#

seriously all this talk of how shite england were falls squarely on the shoulders of the management .. sven needs to fuck off

maybe england need to play lesser teams to build themselves up a bit, maybe they should play,oh i dont know, maybe Denmark,
oh wait a minute............
bwahahahahaha

losCHUNK wrote:listen, every dog has its day and thats all that happened, yes england were shit but poor old sven was trying to get a win and lost

yes, he was trying because he was trying to get mr golden boots to score a goal whilst at the same time fucking everyone else up in the process...i wont call e ngland shit, because i know they aint, but england were looking for a win and ireland ruined that....

IF england fluffs the next 2 games, then you know its curtains

well fuckadoodle all this malarky and we agree in the end anyway, at least about sanchez's ugly-as-sin 'greek' tactics, which were pretty obvious. i expect this will change though. everyone noticed that otto reihagel got a euro trophy for greece playing like this, so an effective counter will be developed eventually to what is basically winning through negativity.

having said that, perhaps sven anticipated that happening, which is why he put becks in that well-protected holding role, to give him space on the ball to put in quality crosses/passes for players to peel off the slow NI defenders (shaun wright-philips was doing this fairly well, but no decent end-product). on paper that sounds like a sound tactic, but for some reason it didn't work. oh, and lousy NI tackling won loads of free kicks and corners, which should have yielded something but again, pisspoor end-product from england.

so maybe sven had the right idea, but the team let him down after all..?

seremtan wrote:
so maybe sven had the right idea, but the team let him down after all..?

busetibi wrote: the manager can only do so much, at the end of the day its up to the players to perform,
pity they performed like 12yr olds

at last you see the fucking light!
so next time....
christ mate get a clue before you sound off

lol, says the bitter idiot who just guessed because he didn't see the game

DRuM wrote:England have done pretty well in recent games haven't they? I thought sven was doing ok and had respect from most people. They lost this game, does that mean he should be replaced?

Sorry for the late reply.

I just find that England plays a very "negative" style of game under Sven. 70% of the reason I say he should be fired is from a fan's perspective--that its not very interesting to watch and that a more explosive, more offensive style would be more exciting. 30% of the reason I say he should be fired is because his style really isn't that good IMO.

Just look at World Cup 2002. Yeah they got a lot of the results but in every game, what was their strategy? To defend, defend, defend and then if the other team makes a slight mistake, score a goal and then defend like crazy.

Its just barely getting by. Look at the game against Argentina. They played a defensive game. Then, a phantom foul was called favouring Owen and England went up 1-0. And then back to defending.

So sure, it works from time to time but sometimes it really just doesnt. Thats not to say that other game styles dont break down but I think sometimes it just comes out really badly and leaves an awful feeling that you lost not necessarily because of the quality of the players but because you were playing in a dumb way.

For example, they were doing fine (in a defensive manner, waiting for Brazil to make a mistake) in WC2002. Lucio made a mistake and England went up 1-0. But when they all of a sudden saw they were tied 1-1, they were completely lost in what they needed to do. It got even worse when Brazil went up 2-1. They had very little direction there IMO.

They didnt go on a crazy offensive juggernaut or anything, they seemed struck, as if: "hey, our defensive style wont get us any goals, what to do now?"

Anyway, I guess the problem when you cut down to it is essentially two fold:

(1) winning barely or always trying to scrape out a win will win you a few games but just went you need it, it might bite you very hard from time to time regardless of the quality of your players. "Negative" soccer :icon13:

(2) no matter how you look at it, with the quality of players England has, they should be doing a lot better job.

Random note: why is there this mutual ass kissing between Owen and Sven? Owen backs Sven and Sven backs Owen. Owen has not played a single full game all season. He should not start on the national squad IMO.

Chupacabra wrote:Just look at World Cup 2002. Yeah they got a lot of the results but in every game, what was their strategy? To defend, defend, defend and then if the other team makes a slight mistake, score a goal and then defend like crazy.

it's boring to watch but worth remembering that greece won euro2004 playing this way

oh, and NI beat england playing this way too

oh yeah, and every game italy ever play they play this way

but yeah, it really only suits 2nd-rate sides with nothing in attack though

good point. though a lot of people were saying that WC2002 really awarded a lot teams that went out on the attack. a glaring example of the opposite of course is germany's WC team. they played well in the final but the other games . . . that paraguay vs. germany game was the WORST.

well anyway, even if it might work for some, its definitely something to steer away from IMO.

hahahahaha England lost to NI.
England are shit.

blood.angel wrote:hahahahaha England lost to NI.
England are shit.

lol - shouldn't you be outside killing your countries children with stray petrol bombs and bullets?