Quake3World

xer0s wrote:Of course all of humanity should denounce their actions. But if these "lunatics" are going to listen and reason with anyone, it's going to be someone of their own religion. No one else has a chance of getting through to them...

seremtan wrote:i hate to derail the thread away from this inspiring discussion about how culpable every Muslim in the world is for the actions of three murderers, but isn't it about time we started standing up for free speech when it isn't being taken away with AK rounds? like, for example, when it's taken away with various hate speech laws or at the behest of a Twittermob of self-appointed offencerati, as it is being on an almost weekly basis - even in the United States (see: campus censorship)?

did you know for instance that Charlie Hebdo were once sued under such hate speech laws? (they won, but the fact that France - and other European countries - has the means to silence people without resorting to riddling them with bullets does put all this #jesuischarlie, vigil-holding, minute-silence-observing stuff into perspective)

HM-PuFFNSTuFF wrote:Frankie Boyle ‏@frankieboyle 4h4 hours ago

I'm reading a defence of free speech in a paper that tried to have me arrested and charged with obscenity for making a joke about the Queen

xer0s wrote: Of course all of humanity should denounce their actions. But if these "lunatics" are going to listen and reason with anyone, it's going to be someone of their own religion. No one else has a chance of getting through to them...

Despite all medical efforts, a pregnant Muslim woman who was attacked by two Islamophobic men in the Paris suburb of Argenteuil on Thursday suffered a miscarriage and lost her baby, her lawyer said on Tuesday.

The 21-year-old Muslim woman, who was four months pregnant, was physically attacked by two men. The attackers first tried taking her headscarf off and later cut off her hair and tore part of her clothing. After she screamed out that she was pregnant, one of the attackers started kicking her in the stomach.

xer0s wrote:Someone whispered in their ear and made them believe murder was the answer. So it's not completely unheard of to think someone could stop them by reason. It's worth a shot isn't it? If it only saves one life, is it worth a shot to stand up and denounce?

HM-PuFFNSTuFF wrote:Here is something to make you all feel better...

Despite all medical efforts, a pregnant Muslim woman who was attacked by two Islamophobic men in the Paris suburb of Argenteuil on Thursday suffered a miscarriage and lost her baby, her lawyer said on Tuesday.

The 21-year-old Muslim woman, who was four months pregnant, was physically attacked by two men. The attackers first tried taking her headscarf off and later cut off her hair and tore part of her clothing. After she screamed out that she was pregnant, one of the attackers started kicking her in the stomach.

xer0s wrote:Someone whispered in their ear and made them believe murder was the answer. So it's not completely unheard of to think someone could stop them by reason. It's worth a shot isn't it? If it only saves one life, is it worth a shot to stand up and denounce?

HM-PuFFNSTuFF wrote:MMMMMMMMUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRR

Every time an extremist who is Muslim commits an act of terrorism, people ask where the moderate Muslim voices condemning violence are. (Interestingly, as a Jew, I don’t usually get asked to condemn extremism when it is perpetuated by Jewish fundamentalists like Baruch Goldstein, who shot 29 praying Muslims do death, and injured 125, at the Cave of the Patriarchs, or Yigal Amir, who killed Israeli Prime MinisterYitzhak Rabin.) And the same thing is happening following this week’s deplorable, pathetic, and tragic killing of 12 people at the offices of the French satirical newspaper Charlie Hebdo.

syp0s wrote:

xer0s wrote:Someone whispered in their ear and made them believe murder was the answer. So it's not completely unheard of to think someone could stop them by reason. It's worth a shot isn't it? If it only saves one life, is it worth a shot to stand up and denounce?

No, that's called being a psychopath. There are thousands, if not millions of them all over the world. Some are lucky enough to attach an ideology to their actions, others go to Walmart, buy some guns, and shoot up a school.

Eraser wrote:
These extremists in Paris are lunatics, sure, I'll go along with you on that train of thought, but there's also hundreds of insecure young Muslims who are easily convinced into packing their stuff and going to Syria to supposedly fight for a good/holy/whatever cause. I'm sure that a good portion (majority, if not most of them) of these young men (still boys in some cases) aren't nutcases and can be convinced not to go, if the right people talk to them.
I also think that the real lunacy probably doesn't surface until they're completely disconnected from their home (and family) and 24/7 under the influence of bad men. So I don't think it's improbable that incidents like these can be prevented by giving these people sincere and positive guidance at a much earlier time.

Maybe it's not a strange thought to compare this to loverboys seducing and abusing young girls. These girls are insecure about themselves, have no goals and are easily brainwashed into believing things about themselves and the world around them because they honestly don't know any better. If a strong, seemingly trustworthy figure who appears to respect you tells you something is like this and that, you'd be inclined to take his word for it. These girls aren't crazy, but very naive and severely misguided.

syp0s wrote:There's always an argument that one act might encourage another, but I think in the last 15 years, thats largely been proven as propaganda.

There aren't droves of kids heading to Syria, and one school shooting doesn't trigger waves of others.

The people heading to Syria aren't all beheading and executing people for the crime of satire, either. That kind of punishment is still being dealt exclusively by lone maniacs, reported by the media as "Islamic extremists".

feedback wrote:There are enough of them that it's a serious problem. People need to stop plugging their eyes and ears and thinking that if they get stockholm-syndrome enough, these psychopathic murderers wouldn't sooner saw their heads off in public than hear any opinion that they disagreed with.

The chain of events that led to the massacre in Paris may well have been sparked off by a classroom discussion in the banlieus of Paris or Marseilles. Some pupils were no doubt certain that the Holocaust was a myth. And the defensive way their teachers dealt with their points would only have strengthened their conviction, itself informed by their older peers at home. Throughout their teenage years, their alienation from French society would have gained in force. They then encountered radical Islam, a medium to express their alienation, and the rest is history. But if Europe wakes up, this won’t necessarily be the future.