Quake3World

"knowing" that smoking a cigarette is dangerous is stored in your subconcious right. maybe if you look at ways that people manipulate your subconcious (hypnosys?) you can find sure ways of controlling it.

Having a goal (besides getting high) helps a great deal. Anything that interferes with that goal becomes easy to avoid or abstain from.

LeonardoP wrote:

saturn wrote:you have Naloxon which is a morfine-antagonist, but it works short so you monitor the patient.

Rapid detox is dangerous for opiate-dependant people. You need a long working opiate so they don't get those dips and highs from short-working opiates

how come the detox is dangerous?

if you antagonize too quickly you can get an abstinence syndrome, you can get side-effects like sweating, vomiting, tachycardia, hypo- and hypertension, hyperventilation, tremors, cardiac arrest, so on so on

I won't tell you the mechanism behind this all

saturn wrote:

LeonardoP wrote:does anyone have a site with info on how the brain works? in respect to ways of storing information and subconcious/concious levels interacting.

go buy a book, like Neuroscience.
http://oas2000.proxis.be/gate/jabba.sg. ... 0878937250

....103e ill look into books, but no sites with valid info you know of?

saturn wrote:

LeonardoP wrote:

saturn wrote:you have Naloxon which is a morfine-antagonist, but it works short so you monitor the patient.

Rapid detox is dangerous for opiate-dependant people. You need a long working opiate so they don't get those dips and highs from short-working opiates

how come the detox is dangerous?

if you antagonize too quickly you can get an abstinence syndrome, you can get side-effects like sweating, vomiting, tachycardia, hypo- and hypertension, hyperventilation, tremors, cardiac arrest, so on so on

I won't tell you the mechanism behind this all

I said the same thing, without the medical jargon. I don't have the piece of paper that lets me do that...

LeonardoP wrote:does anyone have a site with info on how the brain works? in respect to ways of storing information and subconcious/concious levels interacting.

Dunno about many online resources, but you might use this to get started:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connectionism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamicism

Are there any specific questions you're interested in?

what drug instantly frees bound opiates from the receptor, what competitor is that? And how would that effect the body if the freed opiate can't bind to opiate-receptors?

[xeno]Julios wrote:

LeonardoP wrote:does anyone have a site with info on how the brain works? in respect to ways of storing information and subconcious/concious levels interacting.

Dunno about many online resources, but you might use this to get started:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Memory

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Connectionism

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamicism

Are there any specific questions you're interested in?

no it's more of an interest in the subject. i've been watching derren brown and his tricks and it has got me interested in how the brain really works on a subconcious level, there seems to be alot of potential. thnx for the sites :icon14:

saturn wrote:what drug instantly frees bound opiates from the receptor, what competitor is that? And how would that effect the body if the freed opiate can't bind to opiate-receptors?

Give me a minute and I'll find it.

LeonardoP wrote:"knowing" that smoking a cigarette is dangerous is stored in your subconcious right. maybe if you look at ways that people manipulate your subconcious (hypnosys?) you can find sure ways of controlling it.

Knowledge isn't encoded explicitly in the brain. Also I'm not sure that it's useful to take the distinction of conscious vs. subconscious too far.

Hypnosis might work, but I favour more agent-controlled methods of instigating "deep learning", such as careful reflection. Those modifications to the mind are probably more sustainable than quick&cheap fixes such as hypnosis (if indeed hypnosis is a quick&cheap fix).

LeonardoP wrote:

[xeno]Julios wrote:

LeonardoP wrote:does anyone have a site with info on how the brain works? in respect to ways of storing information and subconcious/concious levels interacting

Are there any specific questions you're interested in?

no it's more of an interest in the subject. i've been watching derren brown and his tricks and it has got me interested in how the brain really works on a subconcious level, there seems to be alot of potential. thnx for the sites :icon14:

:upsy: GOOD SHOW! Makes me want to learn more about that too

Hrmm...I am sure I read about something used in rapid detox to do this...but perhaps I am mistaken.

Ok, then, Saturn...

If I am mistaken (which is possible), when they do rapid detox - what do they do to accelerate the process of detox the patient beyond what the patient would normally experience?
I was under the assumption there was a medication used to free the receptors first, followed by using something like naloxone to block the receptors up...

saturn wrote:i quit smoking once suddenly without planning, i just threw the cigarette and the pack away while I was cycling through the city. Then I didn't touch it for 3-4 months while I have a lot of smoking friends (who offered cigs all the time, bitches). I said to myself that I wasn't a slave and did not need it.

Worked fine, till I went to Thailand for a few weeks vacation and had one cigarette on the airport of Bangkok. After that it was 4 weeks of partying, seeing temples, booze, cigs. I never recovered from that

I need a new magic moment with some out-of-the-blue willpower.

That's where I am. I quit once the same way - just said I didn't need them and threw them away - and didn't smoke for about 3-4 months.
It was that one cigarette I had when I was stressed at work one day and stepped outside.... I'm not sure how it happened, but within the next 2 days I was buying packs again.

I need a newfound moment of willpower like that again too.

saturn wrote:but you know, once an addict, always an addict. There are irreversible changes in your brains that affect the balance between dopamine, serotonine and a few other neurotransmitters.

I know people who haven't smoked in 20 years, but still have a craving now and then. And they still believe that if they ever smoked 1 or 2 cigarettes again, they would be right back up to their old levels in no time.

Not sure if it's the same with other drugs or not, since cigarettes are far more habit-forming than most others - I.E. you can smoke while doing anything, and everything from coffee to alcohol to after sex to first thing in the morning can become linked to having a cigarette.

andyman wrote:

LeonardoP wrote:

[xeno]Julios wrote: no it's more of an interest in the subject. i've been watching derren brown and his tricks and it has got me interested in how the brain really works on a subconcious level, there seems to be alot of potential. thnx for the sites :icon14:

:upsy: GOOD SHOW! Makes me want to learn more about that too

hah yeah, i just got his entire mind control, trick of the mind season 1 series in and the season 2 episoded until now. you seen the trick he pulled with the Waking Dead game? lol that was wicked

tnf wrote:Hrmm...I am sure I read about something used in rapid detox to do this...but perhaps I am mistaken.

Ok, then, Saturn...

If I am mistaken (which is possible), when they do rapid detox - what do they do to accelerate the process of detox the patient beyond what the patient would normally experience?
I was under the assumption there was a medication used to free the receptors first, followed by using something like naloxone to block the receptors up...

I'm not sure how they would do it here, I'm quite interested since I deal with a lot of pharmacology in the anesthesiology. I'll have to look it up as well.

R00k wrote:

saturn wrote:i quit smoking once suddenly without planning, i just threw the cigarette and the pack away while I was cycling through the city. Then I didn't touch it for 3-4 months while I have a lot of smoking friends (who offered cigs all the time, bitches). I said to myself that I wasn't a slave and did not need it.

Worked fine, till I went to Thailand for a few weeks vacation and had one cigarette on the airport of Bangkok. After that it was 4 weeks of partying, seeing temples, booze, cigs. I never recovered from that

I need a new magic moment with some out-of-the-blue willpower.

That's where I am. I quit once the same way - just said I didn't need them and threw them away - and didn't smoke for about 3-4 months.
It was that one cigarette I had when I was stressed at work one day and stepped outside.... I'm not sure how it happened, but within the next 2 days I was buying packs again.

I need a newfound moment of willpower like that again too.

saturn wrote:but you know, once an addict, always an addict. There are irreversible changes in your brains that affect the balance between dopamine, serotonine and a few other neurotransmitters.

I know people who haven't smoked in 20 years, but still have a craving now and then. And they still believe that if they ever smoked 1 or 2 cigarettes again, they would be right back up to their old levels in no time.

Not sure if it's the same with other drugs or not, since cigarettes are far more habit-forming than most others - I.E. you can smoke while doing anything, and everything from coffee to alcohol to after sex to first thing in the morning can become linked to having a cigarette.

good luck man......having a girlfriend that doesn't smoke helps though ....if you both smoke then it's like a chainreaction, seeing someone smoking triggers your craving centre

:icon32:

saturn wrote:but you know, once an addict, always an addict. There are irreversible changes in your brains that affect the balance between dopamine, serotonine and a few other neurotransmitters.

no thats not correct

Grandpa Stu wrote:um...kind of a petty addiction but i'm sure you remember my obsession with dr pepper. a couple reasons made me "quit" drinking dr pepper. for starters my headaches went away, my bloaty gas feeling went away, my acne practically went away, i overall felt better and i saved a bunch of money.

however you can't really say i quit because i'll occasionally want a soda and will opt for a dr pepper, though very rare. and when i do drink that dr pepper it's like pure bliss, or something like that.

intelligent responsable moderation

sweating out the nicotine in sauna or hot bath will help rid nicotine quicker.

anti-crap food helps greatly as well

tnf wrote:People say that nicotine cravings can be as bad as almost any drug...so, what is the secret to beating them?

I have yet to find out. ( I quit smoking 3 months ago)
I guess Jackieboy was right: "No one ever really quits. A smoker's a smoker, when the gibs are down..."

I'm currently struggling with nicotine addiction in the form of Copenhagen. The times I've quit in the past (my second biggest problem is staying away from it), I've simply told myself: "I'll have a one later, I'm busy right now." It's the redirection at the moment the craving hits that's the key for me. Also, as Jules said, having the proper mindset to quit and catching the rationalizations as they happen.
It's a cast-iron bitch to quit.

Billy Bellend wrote:

saturn wrote:but you know, once an addict, always an addict. There are irreversible changes in your brains that affect the balance between dopamine, serotonine and a few other neurotransmitters.

no thats not correct

no u

:icon27:

saturn wrote:

Billy Bellend wrote:

saturn wrote:but you know, once an addict, always an addict. There are irreversible changes in your brains that affect the balance between dopamine, serotonine and a few other neurotransmitters.

no thats not correct

no u

:icon27:

well you see things like this are so easy for me and others that its hard for us to understand just how much of a stuggle it is for you.

drugs can be enjoyable, hence the addiction.