Quake3World

Tormentius wrote:

mrd wrote:I think MS needs to realize that they can't just change a whole bunch of shit around and expect everyone to follow suit happily. I don't think they have that kind of weight to throw around anymore. Especially with Firefox getting so popular... I don't even think I know anyone that still uses IE.

They still have over 80% of the market and since they're still the only browser which can be controlled via policies on a network their corporate base isn't going anywhere. I think that the advent of Firefox has forced them to realize that they need to continue developing IE and making it more standards compliant though, and that kind of competition benefits everybody.

Ah, fair enough. Didn't know about the policies thing. It seems weird that they still control so much of the market... cuz like I said... I actually don't know a single person that uses IE

Eraser wrote:

Grudge wrote:from what I've heard, they seem to have done nothing to improve the standards compliance, they've just added tabs and security features

so I'm guessing they use the same (shitty) rendering engine as IE6, which means that it will still render the crappy code that people make in MS Word in a very lenient way while not adhering to the XHTML standards, forcing serious developers to use IE-specific hacks

They have made some significant changes to the way IE7 handles CSS and such so there are definitely changes. If those changes are actual improvements remains to be seen.

Fact is that a large number of IE6 optimized sites wont work with IE7 anymore.

Ok, that's actually a good thing then because IE6 optimized is more or less the opposite of standards compliant.

blowfury wrote:http://www.ie7.com

lollrs

blowfury wrote:http://www.ie7.com

PhoeniX wrote:

Saw this earlier

lol

so where are these tabs we've been hearing about? looks like the same shitty IE i know and loathe

mrd wrote:
Ah, fair enough. Didn't know about the policies thing. It seems weird that they still control so much of the market... cuz like I said... I actually don't know a single person that uses IE

A large part of that market share is due to IE being used on corporate systems. With only a couple exceptions, the people I know are using IE with XP SP2.

Man, am I the only one who misses Internet Explorer CHANNELS?

http://www.opera.com

Grudge wrote:

Eraser wrote:

Grudge wrote:from what I've heard, they seem to have done nothing to improve the standards compliance, they've just added tabs and security features

so I'm guessing they use the same (shitty) rendering engine as IE6, which means that it will still render the crappy code that people make in MS Word in a very lenient way while not adhering to the XHTML standards, forcing serious developers to use IE-specific hacks

They have made some significant changes to the way IE7 handles CSS and such so there are definitely changes. If those changes are actual improvements remains to be seen.

Fact is that a large number of IE6 optimized sites wont work with IE7 anymore.

Ok, that's actually a good thing then because IE6 optimized is more or less the opposite of standards compliant.

And its a bad thing because now we have to test and develop shit in Firefox, IE6, and IE7 (and Opera and Safari if you want an even larger user base).

seremtan wrote:

PhoeniX wrote:

Saw this earlier

lol

so where are these tabs we've been hearing about? looks like the same shitty IE i know and loathe

Right here.

[lvlshot]http://www.jwivie.com/tabs.jpg[/lvlshot]

bitWISE wrote:

Grudge wrote:

Eraser wrote: They have made some significant changes to the way IE7 handles CSS and such so there are definitely changes. If those changes are actual improvements remains to be seen.

Fact is that a large number of IE6 optimized sites wont work with IE7 anymore.

Ok, that's actually a good thing then because IE6 optimized is more or less the opposite of standards compliant.

And its a bad thing because now we have to test and develop shit in Firefox, IE6, and IE7 (and Opera and Safari if you want an even larger user base).

Well, if your code complies to the standard it should work automagically in both FF and IE7, and you only have to make some hacks for IE6, so it should be more or less the same as before.

Grudge wrote:

bitWISE wrote:

Grudge wrote: Ok, that's actually a good thing then because IE6 optimized is more or less the opposite of standards compliant.

And its a bad thing because now we have to test and develop shit in Firefox, IE6, and IE7 (and Opera and Safari if you want an even larger user base).

Well, if your code complies to the standard it should work automagically in both FF and IE7, and you only have to make some hacks for IE6, so it should be more or less the same as before.

I didn't think IE7 was fully compliant. If it is the only real problem becomes detecting the actual browser version as opposed to simply seeing that they have IE.

scourge34 wrote:Right here.

[lvlshot]http://www.jwivie.com/tabs.jpg[/lvlshot]

PLOTS??? :icon28:

Opera has correctly rendered that page for years now.

rep wrote:Opera has correctly rendered that page for years now.

Yeah, but the ACID test is a completely useless and overrated benchmark.

Grudge wrote: Well, if your code complies to the standard it should work automagically in both FF and IE7, and you only have to make some hacks for IE6, so it should be more or less the same as before.

If only that were true. Unfortunately it isn't.
For instance, one thing IE and FF do different is the way they handle the CSS padding keyword.

Padding is used to define the space between the edge of, say, a DIV element and the content within that element.

To determine the width of the DIV, Firefox takes the width property of the DIV and adds the padding to that, together totalling the actual width of the DIV element. So a div with a 100px width and 10px padding is actually 110px wide with a content width of 100px.

In IE, padding is inside the DIV element, so the same div as before has an actual width of 100px with a content width of 90px.

Just one example of a difference between the two browsers.
Firefox is the one using the w3c standard implementation of padding here by the way.

theres still discussion about which boxmodel is correct. theres a css declaration (that IE also understands) in which you can define the box model that it should use..

but, annoying nonetheless

it's a bloated piece of interwebbing shit.

IE7 also added support for XMLRequestObject which breaks some ActiveX based AJAX code.

scourge34 wrote:

seremtan wrote:

PhoeniX wrote:

Saw this earlier

lol

so where are these tabs we've been hearing about? looks like the same shitty IE i know and loathe

Right here.

[lvlshot]http://www.jwivie.com/tabs.jpg[/lvlshot]

how does S@M come to have the last post in mod/admin dicksuction?

seremtan wrote:

scourge34 wrote:

seremtan wrote: lol

so where are these tabs we've been hearing about? looks like the same shitty IE i know and loathe

Right here.

[lvlshot]http://www.jwivie.com/tabs.jpg[/lvlshot]

how does S@M come to have the last post in mod/admin dicksuction?

Post which has been moved there.

I've been using IE 7 Beta for some time seems OK haven't tried the full release yet but I did get it downloaded I'll install and see how I like it this weekend.

Only thing I've found so far that I don't like is if you use instant bb code to tag your URL and use it after you have pasted the article in your window the rest of your post will disappear or just leave the first paragraph. Works all right if you use your tags first then paste in the rest of your post.

IE7 looks like Firefox 2 with a Microsoft skin.
Except it is not. Not even close to my Firefox.

Turbine wrote:IE7 looks like Firefox 2 with a Microsoft skin.
Except it is not. Not even lose to my Firefox.

I don't like how they took the menu out and wont let you put it back on top.

Why use it then?

On a side note, I love installing Firefox 2 on school and public library computers. On every chance I get.

I love watching the reaction of some people, when they say just how smooth the browser feels and runs. For example right now I was running IE6 here in the library. A total piece of shit. it always slows down when opening up a new website, slows down for a good 20 seconds, before rendering. I now installed Firefox 2 and its as smooth as butter.

To bad it will be wiped as soon as someone restarts this computer.


To see just how horrible IE is take the Acid2 test.
http://www.webstandards.org/files/acid2/test.html
http://www.webstandards.org/action/acid2/