President Trump

[YourGrandpa]

Can you please explain exactly how we determine when illegal is illegal and when illegal is not illegal? Because I'm pretty sure someone will be screaming discrimination if the law isn't applied equally. No?

[xer0s]

At this point aren’t we all just impatiently waiting for Mueller to drop the hammer? It’s the only way out of this mess. That or the 2020 election...

[MKJ]

You are absolutely right. It is very important to define what is and what isn't legal. We do that by The Law.
However, violating the law isn't automatically a crime. It can be, but it can also be a felony or a misdemeanor.
Being in the US without the proper documents is in fact a misdemeanor, which does not result in incarceration.
Speaking of illegal, detaining 4 year olds because of a misdemeanor their parents comitted (or detaining minors at all for that matter) is not only against the Law, it's also a gross violation of Human Rights.

You can not overtly decide to ignore your own laws and the human rights, especially as a bargaining tool to get other laws passed, and still call yourself the leader of the free world.

On a personal note I would probably have more respect if the Trump Administration owned up to this zero tolerance policy, instead of hiding behind "the law the Democrats made" pretending your hands are tied. It's not a law, it's a policy, and one (proudly) set by Republican Jeff Sessions.
If you can sign executive orders to help your pipeline friends, or to recall DACA, or to start a travel ban, you can use your power to roll back a simple policy. Or don't if you don't want to, but then at least take responsibility for it.

[YourGrandpa]

Please answer the question below.

Since you are against innocent children being separated from their parents when they illegally enter the US. What would you do? Do we put the entire family in a cell together, where the child could get harmed by other detainees? Would you put the entire family up at a local Comfort Inn, where they could come and go as they please? Or do we just turn them around at the boarder and send them back into the desert? Certainly you have to consider the importance of legal immigration and know that almost any living situation provided here in the states is 10 times better... You should also consider how this could encourage parents/human traffickers to bring children with them to get special consideration crossing the boarder.

[seremtan]

btw how long has this been going on. under Obama?

[YourGrandpa]

This was pre-Obama.

[fKd]

In the land of immigrants its amazing how little empathy you guys have towards immigrants...

[shaft]

You are absolutely right. It is very important to define what is and what isn't legal. We do that by The Law.
However, violating the law isn't automatically a crime. It can be, but it can also be a felony or a misdemeanor.
Being in the US without the proper documents is in fact a misdemeanor, which does not result in incarceration.
Speaking of illegal, detaining 4 year olds because of a misdemeanor their parents comitted (or detaining minors at all for that matter) is not only against the Law, it's also a gross violation of Human Rights.

You can not overtly decide to ignore your own laws and the human rights, especially as a bargaining tool to get other laws passed, and still call yourself the leader of the free world.

On a personal note I would probably have more respect if the Trump Administration owned up to this zero tolerance policy, instead of hiding behind "the law the Democrats made" pretending your hands are tied. It's not a law, it's a policy, and one (proudly) set by Republican Jeff Sessions.
If you can sign executive orders to help your pipeline friends, or to recall DACA, or to start a travel ban, you can use your power to roll back a simple policy. Or don't if you don't want to, but then at least take responsibility for it.

Also gramps is a massive moron plz don’t waste your time on him. In fact if we could work out some diplomatic trade, the US electorate would rather have you.

[xer0s]

In the land of immigrants its amazing how little empathy you guys have towards immigrants...

“you guys”

[fKd]

Do you need me to be more specific?

[Transient]

Like Puff said, Republicans backed the policy by 55%, the only party, gender, education, age or racial group to support it.

I certainly don't feel like Republicans represent me, so I'd rather not be lumped in with them whet you say "you guys".

[xer0s]

Aw yes, I am personally caging children at the border...

[Scourge]

Our immigration system has been fucked up for as long as I've been alive, but never before has a president torn disenfranchised families apart and used them as a bargaining chip to get laws passed. There's a bit of a difference.

Agreed, not arguing that point.

[YourGrandpa]

Also gramps is a massive moron plz don’t waste your time on him. In fact if we could work out some diplomatic trade, the US electorate would rather have you.

I'm not the dipshit here treating this type of incident like it's the epicenter of America's immigration problem. This is merely a by product of a broken system that needs repair. So instead of doing anything about it, government chooses to use the situation to smear the opposition. If you think the left's sudden concern for the well being of immigrant children is anything more than a smoke screen to detract from Trump's touted success with North Korea, you're the moron.

[YourGrandpa]

In the land of immigrants its amazing how little empathy you guys have towards immigrants...

I don't know where you live. But I'm pretty sure you guys don't have an open boarder policy.

[HM-PuFFNSTuFF]

It's tragic that people as ignorant as gwamps exist.

[YourGrandpa]

Ignorance?

https://www.dhs.gov/news/2018/06/18/myt ... nce-policy

*crickets

[shaft]

btw how long has this been going on. under Obama?

Under previous administrations not everyone crossing was criminally prosecuted and certainly not separated from their children. In certain cases they would keep the family 20 days (legal limit for holding a child) then release them with an ankle monitor until trial.

Interview with a 40yr immigration lawyer.

[youtube]59lwppXzjvo[/youtube]

[shaft]

https://apnews.com/dc0c9a5134d14862ba7c7ad9a811160e

Since the White House announced its zero tolerance policy in early May, more than 2,300 children have been taken from their parents at the U.S.-Mexico border, resulting in a new influx of young children requiring government care.

Trump administration officials have been sending babies and other young children forcibly separated from their parents at the U.S.-Mexico border to at least three "tender age" shelters in South Texas, The Associated Press has learned.


Also, NBC has obtained internal CBP documents that show between June 3rd and June 11th, 91% of parents being prosecuted at the border and forcibly separated from their children were being prosecuted with a MISDEMEANOR.

[Transient]

This is merely a by product of a broken system that needs repair. So instead of doing anything about it, government chooses to use the situation to smear the opposition. If you think the left's sudden concern for the well being of immigrant children is anything more than a smoke screen to detract from Drumpf's touted success with North Korea, you're the moron.

Finally, something we agree on! The Democrats are scum for pretending to give a flying fuck about immigrants. They've been playing the "I have a black friend" card for decades. The Republicans are scum for letting Drumpf use thousands of children as bargaining chips to get what he wants. The whole system is fucked, neither party has any credibility, and our Democracy may truly be in jeopardy as a result.

That being said, what Drumpf is doing is morally wrong and it should be stopped. Immigrant families should be allowed to come in, no questions asked. Let them earn citizenship and contribute to our economy and culture.

[scared?]

Gramps is a trumpanzee... What a fucking tool... ...

Also he seems too poor to benefit from the Trump tax cuts... Lol poor ppl...

[Κracus]

At the end of the day, people like Gwamps have to wake up in the morning and look themselves in the mirror and tell themselves, "Today, I'm ok with terrorizing kids to send a message".

I think that speaks volumes about the character of a lot of Americans. They should be ashamed that they even tried to justify it by using mental gymnastics. Every other advanced nation has this problem, no one has to separate kids from their families to verify their identities and process them. The separation of families is absolutely meant to send a message to other immigrants. There's no laws forcing them to do this, they choose to do it by pointing at a policy as their excuse and citing bible verses to solidify their stance. Everyone complicit in this should be held accountable and put behind bars.

[YourGrandpa]

Gramps is a trumpanzee...

Um, no...

[YourGrandpa]

At the end of the day, people like Gwamps have to wake up in the morning and look themselves in the mirror and tell themselves, "Today, I'm ok with terrorizing kids to send a message".

I think that speaks volumes about the character of a lot of Americans. They should be ashamed that they even tried to justify it by using mental gymnastics. Every other advanced nation has this problem, no one has to separate kids from their families to verify their identities and process them. The separation of families is absolutely meant to send a message to other immigrants. There's no laws forcing them to do this, they choose to do it by pointing at a policy as their excuse and citing bible verses to solidify their stance. Everyone complicit in this should be held accountable and put behind bars.

Another incredibly naive and misinformed analysis. No surprise there.

When you can get Obama, Hillary and Trump all to say we need to strengthen our border and not encourage immigrants to use their children to gain access to the US, there's a problem.

I'm 100% for legal immigration, where people go through the naturalization process, become Americans, get jobs and pay taxes.

[Κracus]

Another incredibly naive and misinformed analysis. No surprise there.

When you can get Obama, Hillary and Trump all to say we need to strengthen our border and not encourage immigrants to use their children to gain access to the US, there's a problem.

I'm 100% for legal immigration, where people go through the naturalization process, become Americans, get jobs and pay taxes.

Tell me what part is naive and misinformed. Saying it, doesn't make it so.

Strengthening a border doesn't mean you need to traumatize kids. Get that through your thick head. You can achieve one without enabling the other. Other countries don't have this problem and not only that, immigration is down in the US since 2011. It's not the sensationalized problem you're making it out to be.

That's great that you're for legal immigration, so why are you ok with terrorizing kids to send a message to immigrants? Doesn't make much sense bro.