Wtf

Open discussion about any topic, as long as you abide by the rules of course!
User avatar
plained
Posts: 16366
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2002 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by plained »

Eraser wrote:Beep boop

there u go!

most original though and insight youve ever posted!
it is about time!
User avatar
plained
Posts: 16366
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2002 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by plained »

Κracus i dont know if youre trying to come off as benevolent or educated or compassionate or trying to show humility or what

it isnt working tho,

the guy whoopsie daisy'ed off his meds and ate somebodies sons/dads ears and organs drank the blood played around awile.

and now it is my understanding you want to give him the opportunity to come off his meds again? the odds of re-offence are too high, coupled with the nature of his behavior, no stay locked up.

so some excuses are legit enough to warrant freedom from this level of violent actions? na.

had he came off his meds and sat in the park with his cart eating catshit like puff, i'd say sure let him go!

na it isnt inhumane to have him locked up tight in a work factory and watching tv somewhere . they do it for people who steal and deal.

inhumane is what he did to the victim. also the disrespect all the victims have had with this, that is in-humane .

i see your active compassion for vince li but like all people who think he should walk free, you never ever show any for the victims.
it is about time!
YourGrandpa
Posts: 10074
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by YourGrandpa »

Κracus wrote: Blah blah blah, bleeding heart bullshit...
You've based your entire position on hopes and assumptions, and I'm stupid. :olo:

So is he coming to live with you or what? Because the FACTS still remain. He is schizophrenic, on medication and could possibly kill again. If he can't be responsible for himself, someone should be. That way if he kills again it would be the responsible persons fault... If you had any faith in your hopes and assumptions you would take him in.
User avatar
Κracus
Posts: 5969
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:38 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Κracus »

plained wrote:
the guy whoopsie daisy'ed off his meds

You're going to have to cite that, from my understanding he wasn't being treated for his schizophrenia when that happened and nothing in the article suggests he was which is kinda my whole point. It's an absolute tragedy it happened, no question about that and I most certainly feel awful for the victims family. I still don't think it's ok to vilify him IF he had a mental condition that caused him to do what he did unwillingly.
YourGrandpa
Posts: 10074
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by YourGrandpa »

How someone can be willing to put other people's lives at risk based on ifs and assumptions is beyond me.
User avatar
Κracus
Posts: 5969
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:38 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Κracus »

YourGrandpa wrote:
Κracus wrote: Blah blah blah, bleeding heart bullshit...
You've based your entire position on hopes and assumptions, and I'm stupid. :olo:

So is he coming to live with you or what? Because the FACTS still remain. He is schizophrenic, on medication and could possibly kill again. If he can't be responsible for himself, someone should be. That way if he kills again it would be the responsible persons fault... If you had any faith in your hopes and assumptions you would take him in.

That's entirely incorrect. My position isn't based on faith, hope or assumptions. It's based on compassion and an open mind. So he's schizophrenic? Many people are, should they all be locked up? If he can't be responsible for himself someone would be. In fact, that's been the case for several years already and it's come to the point where those that are responsible for him are able to say at this point in time that they feel, based on his behavior, that he's capable of being responsible for himself but I doubt it's that simple. I highly suspect he's still being monitored to some degree.

Let's say you're right though, and he does kill again. Should his handlers be held responsible? I think so and I also think he should be held accountable and locked up indefinitely but I don't think we should jump there without trying treatment first. If you replace the term Schizophrenic with Diabetes the concept of taking drugs to fix a problem suddenly seems alright but why isn't it ok for schizophrenia? That's the real problem here. People like you stigmatize real mental issues like that to such a degree that those that legitimately have it might not seek treatment and then eat peoples ears.

Imagine if diabetics had the same stigma? Some might rather just die than get treated, it's absolutely ridiculous and shouldn't be the case and that's really the problem with mental health issues.

You can choose to believe your own hyperbole if you want but I choose not to. I think people that suffer from diagnosed, real, mental health problems deserve treatment as much as any other non mental health related problem.
User avatar
Κracus
Posts: 5969
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:38 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Κracus »

YourGrandpa wrote:How someone can be willing to put other people's lives at risk based on ifs and assumptions is beyond me.
Denying someone a life because of a treatable disease is beyond me.
YourGrandpa
Posts: 10074
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by YourGrandpa »

He's ALREADY KILLED SOMEONE you MORON. That mean he's capable of doing it again. Of course you don't lock up someone just because they're schizophrenic. You lock them up because they're a murdering schizophrenic. Schizophrenia isn't curable and treatment is the responsibility of the schizophrenic. You don't let that person back into society in hopes it never happens again. You keep them under lock and key to guarantee it.

Again you've avoided the question of putting yourself and your family's life on the line for this guy. Maybe it's because you don't really have enough faith in what you're saying. But it's easy for to have a position like this because your family member wasn't brutally murdered and you'll never be at risk.

YOU are what's wrong with society.
User avatar
Κracus
Posts: 5969
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:38 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Κracus »

No, asking some random family to care for a mental health patient is just ridiculous and not at all a realistic scenario.

Yeah he killed someone, I get that, really I do. Lets say a diabetic passes out at the wheel and kills someone but didn't know he was diabetic. Jail for life? Or get treatment?

Because this is a mental health problem, you and many other people feel he should be locked up and the key should be thrown away. It's a complete double standard and it's based on a medieval mind frame that's simply ignorant.

You're also ignoring my point of what if he doesn't kill anyone else? What if he actually had a problem and actually got help and is actually better and actually wasn't responsible for his actions? What about those possibilities?

Nah, you'd rather just kill him and be done with it. Forget trying to treat it, learn from it, figure out what's actually causing it and how to prevent it and a number of other benefits.

Shit, think about this, what if YOU become schizophrenic? Wouldn't you want to be able to get treatment for it? Treatment that's been used and tested and known to work because of people like him? Nah, lets just bury our heads in the sand and kill him and just perpetuate the problem even longer so MORE people with schizophrenia kill even MORE people.

Yeah... pft, finding solutions to these problems, who needs that noise?
YourGrandpa
Posts: 10074
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by YourGrandpa »

Κracus wrote: If, if, if , if.
Let's risk more lives on ifs... I'll play your IF game. What IF he stops responding to his medication and kills someone else? Do we lock him up again, give him more rehab, change his medication and release him back into society? Because after all it's not his fault and his quality of life in paramount to public safety... Exactly how many people can he kill before he should be locked away for good? You've obviously decided that his quality of life is more important than the person he killed.

And diabetes can be physically monitored and generally doesn't kill other people when it isn't treated. :tard:
YourGrandpa
Posts: 10074
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by YourGrandpa »

Κracus wrote:No, asking some random family to care for a mental health patient is just ridiculous and not at all a realistic scenario.
My point was, you wouldn't put you or your family in harms ways. But you have no problem with putting someone else at risk.
Doombrain
Posts: 23226
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Doombrain »

HM-PuFFNSTuFF wrote:
Doombrain wrote:wat
i get the feeling that plained was beheaded at some point but his body is still in front of a keyboard and typing. Would explain a lot. :olo:
:olo:
Doombrain
Posts: 23226
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Doombrain »

Eraser wrote:I like to think it's his disembodied head still behind the PC, trying to type by continually smacking his forehead into the keyboard.
Lol!
User avatar
plained
Posts: 16366
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2002 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by plained »

your desperate rabidity :olo:
it is about time!
User avatar
Eraser
Posts: 19168
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2000 8:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Eraser »

plained has such a poor sense of humour.
A true poorian, if you will
Ryoki
Posts: 13460
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2001 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Ryoki »

Obs said it best.

My 2 cts, perhaps worth something as i've worked with this particular group of people for six years: even though there's no check on if he takes his medication you can be sure he receives visits or is compelled by law to see someone once every so often for evaluations. And if he stops taking his medication this will be noticed before he can do something similar, you don't go full florid psychosis in 1 week.

And yeah, as weird as it sounds this guy is a victim too; it's unlikely he has any recollection of the event. From his perspective he woke up all medicated and was told he killed and ate some poor dude. Shit, he probably receives or has received trauma councelling for that.
[size=85][color=#0080BF]io chiamo pinguini![/color][/size]
User avatar
Eraser
Posts: 19168
Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2000 8:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Eraser »

I'm guessing there's a great cutursal divide at work here as well, between people like YGP and plained on one end, and obsidian and yourself on the other.
User avatar
plained
Posts: 16366
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2002 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by plained »

Eraser wrote:plained has such a poor sense of humour.
A true poorian, if you will

oh come on i was hoping u werent going all butthurt over a tiny joke!

so it only humor when it about me? :olo:
it is about time!
User avatar
plained
Posts: 16366
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2002 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by plained »

Eraser wrote:I'm guessing there's a great cutursal divide at work here as well, between people like YGP and plained on one end, and obsidian and yourself on the other.

pretty selective choosing there y0
it is about time!
User avatar
Κracus
Posts: 5969
Joined: Tue Oct 16, 2007 12:38 am

Re: Wtf

Post by Κracus »

Yeah really.
losCHUNK
Posts: 16019
Joined: Thu May 09, 2002 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by losCHUNK »

Ryoki wrote:Obs said it best.

My 2 cts, perhaps worth something as i've worked with this particular group of people for six years: even though there's no check on if he takes his medication you can be sure he receives visits or is compelled by law to see someone once every so often for evaluations. And if he stops taking his medication this will be noticed before he can do something similar, you don't go full florid psychosis in 1 week.

And yeah, as weird as it sounds this guy is a victim too; it's unlikely he has any recollection of the event. From his perspective he woke up all medicated and was told he killed and ate some poor dude. Shit, he probably receives or has received trauma councelling for that.
My mate many moons ago developed 'underlying psychosis', thing is, although he didnt seem right we didnt really have any concerns until he went on holiday, had a skinful and came back completely bonkers. He was only gone a week and he was full throttle nuts. At 1st we thought it was fatigue or he drank too much and needed rest but it only took like 3 days before we ended up taking him to the hospital. Some of the shit he was doing, and had us doing n all... bloody hell, theres more than a few stories.

He will tell you himself he wasnt right in the head for a long time before, that his recollection is hazy and almost dreamlike, but the speed he went from weird to bonkers is pretty surprising and scary.

Seems fine now, no medication, just back to his oddball ways.
[color=red] . : [/color][size=85] You knows you knows [/size]
YourGrandpa
Posts: 10074
Joined: Mon Apr 17, 2000 7:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by YourGrandpa »

Eraser wrote:I'm guessing there's a great cutursal divide at work here as well, between people like Whiskey, seremtan, Doombrain, YGP and plained on one end, and obsidian and yourself on the other.
Fixed... :disgust:
User avatar
seremtan
Posts: 36007
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2003 8:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by seremtan »

hey i just objected to victim equivalence that was being made between the attacker and the guy he slashed to death

the attacker clearly wasn't in his right mind, but suggesting that having to live with what he's done is as bad as being dead like the other guy is fucking dumb
User avatar
mrd
Posts: 4289
Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2000 8:00 am

Re: Wtf

Post by mrd »

Seen this the other day... didn't realize they have released him. Hard to know what to think on this. I feel like he should have been locked away for a bit longer at least. Then again our courts are a little fucked on punishment around here. (A local lady recently got out of jail after only 18 months for driving over a 3 or 4 year old toddler and killing her, after driver had had some wine before driving. This after constant appeals to drag it out. If you ask me she should be in there for another 5-10 years at least, and life ban on driving).

I feel like they should at least be monitoring this bus killer guy... especially given the fucked up / brutal nature of the killing. Will be a sad story if this guy slips again and I would not be surprised if it happened either. Great also that he changed his name, although I 'spose that is to be expected.

There is another case from a while back where a father smothered his three children to death with a pillow then went on the lamb. A hunter and his dog ended up finding his scent and tracked him down rambling around in the woods a few weeks later, and called the cops on him. It's been maybe 3-4 years tops since he was jailed and he's already pressing for release. (Alan Schoenberg is the guy, I believe). You ask me, that guy should be in jail for life, minimum... better yet, put him in a work camp. I don't feel like there is much rehabilitation to do on a person who willingly and knowingly murdered their own three children. Surprised the mother hasn't fucking offed herself.
Post Reply