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Topic Starter Topic: Re: Shocking video of Doombrain getting his bike stuck in a fenc
Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:25 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


It is a trap. If it wasn't, they wouldn't be there filming it. They wouldn't have tied it on a slope. They wouldn't have used a rope long enough to cause the mayhem you saw and I'm pretty sure the rope is as concealed as they could manage to make it. All of that was intentional and saying it isn't is just being ignorant and wouldn't fly in court. This is assault plain and simple.
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:34 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


The requirement for a booby trap is concealment, the rope wasn't concealed as it was tied to the fence and the bike, it then trailed off behind them as it went down the slope. The prankster intended for someone to take his bike, that's it, his duty of care ended when someone took it so no laws have been broken.



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Last edited by losCHUNK on 01-12-2017 07:50 AM, edited 1 time in total.
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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:46 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Wow... Ok, so answer me this. If it wasn't a trap, why did the owner of the bike place it there tied up the way he did?
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:50 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


As I said, in law a trap is considered something that is concealed, I edited above to show the intent of the prankster ^. He can tie it up anyway he wishes, give it flat tyres, remove the brakes or loosen the handlebars... so long as the risk is apparent then their is no law being broken.



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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:54 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


lol... yeah I'm sure the "I didn't conceal my trap so it's not a trap" excuse would work brilliantly in court. You're fucking dense.
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:57 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


It's how the law defines it dumb ass, it's not a trap if it isn't concealed and the risk is apparent. Otherwise my power cable outside my house could be considered a trap.

In the case of the video the thief failed to check wether the bike could be ridden, if he had performed his duty of care there would be no accident.



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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 08:03 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 08:23 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Nothing else ?, glad we cleared that up.



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seremtan
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 09:43 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


"putz" :smirk:
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 11:16 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


If you think it's OK to bait people into committing a crime just so you can hurt them and then profit from it, you're fucking sick.



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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 11:41 AM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I'm pretty sure that I never gave an opinion on how I felt about it.

My 1st reply is arguable I spose, but is just the 1st iteration of what I've been saying.



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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 11:52 AM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


You're not arguing dude, you're stating things as black and white facts and laws without considering intent or situations. Talking to you is like talking to a wall, I can make as much sense as I want, you're still not going to reply with a coherent or tangible concept to counter what anyone else is saying.

your logic = tripwires in a retirement homes is a.o.k so long as you can see them.

There's no back and forth, it's like explaining relativity to a 5 year old.
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:02 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


My logic actually discussed the tripwire scenario and how it differs. The thief assumes responsibility as soon as he picked up the bike, you can't intend for someone to steal or take your belongings, that is a decision outside of your control which is why the responsibility shifts from owner to thief / finders keeper, it's why baiting isn't a crime but entrapment is ffs. I've also spoken about the situation and what constitutes as a trap, having a rope blatantly hanging off a seat is not.

So it's not a trap as we established, nor is baiting a crime. So what's the problem ?



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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:14 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


losCHUNK wrote:
you can't intend for someone to steal or take your belongings.


This right here is why you're completely wrong on this one. They did intend for someone to steal it and to say they didn't is completely ludicrous.


edit: Just in case...

lu·di·crous
ˈlo͞odəkrəs/Submit
adjective
so foolish, unreasonable, or out of place as to be amusing; ridiculous.
"it's ludicrous that I have been fined"
synonyms: absurd, ridiculous, farcical, laughable, risible, preposterous, foolish, mad, insane, idiotic, stupid, inane, silly, asinine, nonsensical; informalcrazy
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:17 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


If you intend on someone to steal your bike then you left it there to be taken. No law has been broken hence baiting isn't a crime, you can intend for someone to take it but both those are decisions outside of your control. Then trap bla bla bla



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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:24 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Right bla bla bla intent...

The intent was for the bike to be stolen.

The intent in cutting the brakes.

The intent of putting it on a slope

the intent of tying a rope to it.

But hey, bla bla bla right? Durr hurr lookit da bike teif eat dirt ha! Yeah that's what you sound like to me.
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:38 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Κracus wrote:
Right bla bla bla intent...

The intent was for the bike to be stolen.

The intent in cutting the brakes.

The intent of putting it on a slope

the intent of tying a rope to it.

But hey, bla bla bla right? Durr hurr lookit da bike teif eat dirt ha! Yeah that's what you sound like to me.



Bla bla bla trap actually...

He didn't intend for someone to steal it, so the condition of the bike and the intentions involved with that have nothing to do with it. You can't determine the actions that the individual was undertaking (he could've been going to the police stations lost property box)

He intended for someone to take it, that's it, at their own risk considering its condition. But even then that is loose in the eyes of the law because you can't determine the acts of an individual, hence why baiting isn't a crime but entrapment is... Infact I don't think baiting is even a legal term in a civil case, because you can't intend for someone to take something belonging to you, as this is a decision outside of your control. The only way this would be reasonable is if there was a sign that said 'free bike'.

Beyond that we need to consider if it was a trap or not, which, as we established it is not.



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Last edited by losCHUNK on 01-12-2017 12:50 PM, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:50 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Image



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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:55 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I'd like some of what chunk is smoking though. Must be some pretty good shit.
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AndyW
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:58 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


so when 1 idiot meets another idiot -we get this! (videos)
Great fun and popcorn-discussion... Go on internet, i love you soo much! <3

Blame it on the trees in this one?



:olo:



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Last edited by AndyW on 01-12-2017 01:01 PM, edited 1 time in total.
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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 12:58 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Shall we move onto the definition of a trap now ?

Because ya know, I always walk into traps that have clear warnings :D



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YourGrandpa
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 01:21 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


This scenario was clearly set up to humiliate and or injur unassuming criminally minded individuals. But in order to establish blame you have to prove intent or negligence on their part. Intent would mean they somehow knew the theif was a theif and was going to steal the bike. To prove negligence you'd have to make similar assumptions.

In the end, the situation took care of itself. Arguing for the theif is pointless.
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 01:51 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


theif



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losCHUNK
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 01:57 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


I before E unless after... err, Alzheimers



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YourGrandpa
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 02:26 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


That's odd. Wonder why my phone auto selected that. Swipe isn't always right. Anyway, glad I could find some common ground for you dipshits.

Carry on, if you can.
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Κracus
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 02:29 PM           Profile   Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Hmm that's weird
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 02:30 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Autocorrect excuse. :olo:



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YourGrandpa
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 03:50 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


^ Upset about it :olo:
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 04:06 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


YGP has to get the last word in. :olo:



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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 04:38 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Κracus wrote:
I actually have been in that situation lars, a few times in fact. The guy that stole my Kona Cinderkone got a little roughed up but it wasn't because he stole my bike, he just wouldn't tell me who he sold it to when I found him. At this point I had him in my car so I jammed the brakes on and smashed his face into the dashboard... Got my bike back though. So you're somewhat correct that yeah, I felt like that but I had the opportunity to do much worse to the guy and I didn't.


Oh fucking LOL, this is what I was hoping this thread would produce :olo:
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YourGrandpa
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 06:55 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Transient wrote:
YGP has to get the last word in. :olo:

^ Can't move on. :olo:
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:41 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


Can't stop mentioning the sig. :olo:



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YourGrandpa
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 07:44 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


^Still upset and showing it. :olo:
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 08:29 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


It would take more effort to remove it, I just can't be bothered. You, on the other hand, can't stop mentioning my sig and trying to get a rise out of me. I've never been more amused. I'm not one for trolling people at Q3W, but somehow I seem to have accidentally done just that. :up:



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YourGrandpa
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PostPosted: 01-12-2017 08:52 PM           Profile Send private message  E-mail  Edit post Reply with quote


^Dummy being tolled with his troll. :olo:
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